MiSTer vs NeoSD MVS for neogeo

[rikdenio]

Hi,

Great forum. I love neogeo MVS arcade games and am currently looking at one of two options for the perfect arcade experience at home. Basically I want the best one, closest as possible to the original arcade in terms of graphics, gameplay, sound, accuracy etc. I am looking at two options:

1. The MiSTer setup

2.The much more expensive route of buying a flash cartridge like the Terraonion NeoSD MVS flash cart to use on a consolized Neo Geo MVS Game Console like the Omega Entertainment Machine

Being a MiSTer forum, there maybe bias towards MiSTer but please be honest as possible

(I wasnt sure to start this topic on the the neogeo or arcade forum. Mods feel free to move it to its appropriate place)

Thanks

[Nemesis2k]

You cant get more accurate than the actual hardware. So this question has an obvious answer. However, for cost, I personally would go for a MiSTer as I am not enough of a Neo Geo nut to notice any inaccuracies on MiSTer without watching side by sides. It's down to how much you are willing to pay, and how much knowledge you hold in each game in regards to how they should run.

[darksakul]

So I own both a MVS Board (connected to a super gun) and a MiSTer.

There is a couple of things you have to consider with an Arcade board

If you don't get a consolized kit like the Omega, you have to get a Super Gun, perhaps a power supply and video conversion of some sort.
Another is maintenance. If you going with an MVS, if it isn't already you need to factor in Recapping and even a battery replacement mod.
Yes a good Consolization mod like the Omega would also do this for you. Since Analouge Interactive no longer do MVS mods you got Omega and a hand full of Alibaba Resellers.

Watch out for those Alibaba CMVS kits, they often have incorrect Sync levels as the arcade board puts out TTL Sync not the 75 Ohm Sync Consumer grade equipment expects. The RGB lines as well as the Audio also needs attenuation back down to consumer levels.

If you are not going with a PVM, you need to consider a image scaller like the Framemeister, OSSC or Retrotink 5X.

The last question is are you going to collect MVS carts or not.

For the money the MiSTer is going to be far, far cheaper. The De 10 Nano at the current price of 170 from Digikey, 60 for the SD Ram module
And another $20 for a bigger SD card. That is about $250, but thats all you need to get started. You also need any USB keyboard and Game controller to start. You also have a long list of other Arcade, Console and 80s Microcomputers your Mister can support.

The Omega CMVS starts at $530 and thats without any carts. The Terraonion NeoSD is €549.00 or $673 before shipping.
Thats over $1200. Also add the cost of a PVM or onr of the external scallers I already mentioned.

Now with the actual accuracy of the MiSTer compared to a Omega MVS.
The two are about the same put side by side, about as close as you can possibly get. The MiSTer is cycle accurate for replicating the Neo geo.
The only thing is everything slightly sharper on the MiSTer. There is none of the interference analog signals get with the MiSTer's HDMI output.
Even with the Framemeister, OSSC or Retrotink 5X, there an Analog signal that has to get to those devices first.
Unless you want to play on a CRT, but that on you.

Everything else plays as it should. the MiSTer Neo Geo core is very mature, alot of the MiSTer Neo geo Core development can from a dev named Furrtek who decap proprietary Neo Geo chips to replicate them for to make Neo Geo replacement parts. He took the knowledge he gleamed how the Neo geo works internally and replicate it in FPGA.

As for an Arcade stick? I suggest ether buy a Existing arcade stick and swap out the buttons or make your own. And I mean that for both options.
If you want to use a Game Pad, well the MiSTer will give you more options.

[Insert Disk Two]

I sold my Neo Geo stuff, and many other retro stuff once I got a MiSTer. Hope that helps

[mhartman]

I have two MiSTers, one in a vertical PacMan cab and one in a horizontal Stargate cab. Both are hooked up through Jamma interfaces, J-Pacs, audio amps and original 15kHZ monitors. I just installed the horizontal one the other day because I was so fed up with my NeoGeo MVS and 161-1 combo. Instead of buying the Darksoft cart, I went ahead and did the MiSTer setup. This way I got NeoGeo, Arcade Cores, Nintendo, etc. It works great. I haven't run into any issues with the NeoGeo stuff -- I'm super happy with it.

The only drawback is that you're stuck with the MiSTer menu system, which isn't super user friendly. For parties, you may want to load one game and leave it there. Otherwise, MiSTer is great.

[meauxdal]

There is currently only one option for the "perfect" arcade experience at home, which is original hardware.

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

It should eventually be getting some more love to bring it closer to perfection, but it's been largely dormant for quite a few months at this point. Furrtek has indicated interest in solving the extant issues.

The total impact of these issues on the experience isn't necessarily even noticeable to the average person, but audio issues in particular (music can sound "out of tune" in some cases) will definitely be noticeable to anyone familiar with music on the games it affects.

[hiddenbyleaves]

The sound ain't right on the Neo Geo core, but it will probably be fixed in the future.

[gibs]

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

[Pepeart]

I sold my Neo Geo stuff, and many other retro stuff once I got a MiSTer. Hope that helps

Same Here, Love my Mister Setup

[keilmillerjr]

I have an mvs. I'm waiting for a jamma hat to be available.

I've done 161-in-1 with shitty menu. Switched to PC and jpac. Spent years programming a front end layout. Pc components died. Built another PC. Sick of PC and programming never ending. Waiting to make the jump to mister and be done with it.

[rhester72]

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

You're not wrong...but they are definitely real. That should give you some idea of how much love the core doesn't get.

[rikdenio]

Many thanks to all. It is very helpful and shows how much passion there is for MISter retrogaming. Wonderful community

You cant get more accurate than the actual hardware.

Yes I know I wanted to know the most accurate of the two options. I am leaning towards the MISter as it seems to provide better value than the flashcart option because cores available for other arcade systems as well as mvs

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

You're not wrong...but they are definitely real. That should give you some idea of how much love the core doesn't get.

Now this is worrying. The major reason why I want a MISter setup is for neogeo MVS and if these issues have not been fixed since Feb 2020 then is the MISter the best for neogeo and will they be fixed? I would hope that they will be sorted at some point as they have been present for quite some time

[Chris23235]

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

You're not wrong...but they are definitely real. That should give you some idea of how much love the core doesn't get.

The vast majority of issues listed in the Github seem to be caused by the users and not by the core, e.g.

Cannot load Magical Drop III from USB0 Harddisk

No Sound When trying to play any Neo Geo games.

Missing sound by setting AES or MVS in Unibios

Kof94 Graphics Glitches All Over The Place

Period in game name cuts off title in OSD

NeoGeo sound effects stop playing

svc chaos remix ultra not working

The core seems pretty complete to me. The reason that nothing was updated for a long time now is that the core is already as perfect as possible.

EDIT: After looking longer at the issues in the Github, I would say that none of them seems to be core related, all seem to be problems on the user side.

[rhester72]

This one is the big kahuna:

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues/65

It's like 30 issues in one.

[Chris23235]

This one is the big kahuna:

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues/65

It's like 30 issues in one.

This bug report is from 2019.

Furrtek noted in September 2020:

Most of the issues related to the sprite layer / fix layer shift bug (vertical lines, gfx 1 pixel outside of borders...) should be fixed with 77a2a8e.
Thanks for reporting

[rhester72]

If you test...you'll find that's not the case.

[wodmarach]

The January bug isn't a bug either it's completely accurate. Pulstar just has those glitches on certain screens.

[BlackSpy]

I'm itching to find out. I have a very extensive MVS collection, and MiSTer parts on the way...

I'm after MiSTer for CPS2 and PCEngine stuff, but I'll be interested to see how the NeoGeo stuff holds up. It's definitely my best benchmark to see how MiSTer works.

[wodmarach]

I'm itching to find out. I have a very extensive MVS collection, and MiSTer parts on the way...

It's pretty good but could do with someone sitting down and comparing them side by side to spot actual bugs, MVS carts are getting kinda expensive though.

[pgimeno]

I didn't see this problem reported. In World Heroes Perfect MVS version, after inserting a coin and pressing Start:

Edit: Now that I notice, I see many more similar glitches during the demo.

[mr-box]

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

You're not wrong...but they are definitely real. That should give you some idea of how much love the core doesn't get.

The vast majority of issues listed in the Github seem to be caused by the users and not by the core, e.g.

Cannot load Magical Drop III from USB0 Harddisk

No Sound When trying to play any Neo Geo games.

Missing sound by setting AES or MVS in Unibios

Kof94 Graphics Glitches All Over The Place

Period in game name cuts off title in OSD

NeoGeo sound effects stop playing

svc chaos remix ultra not working

The core seems pretty complete to me. The reason that nothing was updated for a long time now is that the core is already as perfect as possible.

EDIT: After looking longer at the issues in the Github, I would say that none of them seems to be core related, all seem to be problems on the user side.

what you just said is false some of theses are real bugs not problems on the user side but problems in the core . i have tested some of theses with the new 2.9 ram just to rule that out the neogeo needs work not sure what the problem is but its not perfect yet

[mr-box]

I didn't see this problem reported. In World Heroes Perfect MVS version, after inserting a coin and pressing Start:

Edit: Now that I notice, I see many more similar glitches during the demo.

some times a bad corrupt rom will look like that. there is darksoft pack of neo geo roms out there that has a bad Shock Troopers rom in it for example it happens when downloading they can become corrupt

[pgimeno]

some times a bad corrupt rom will look like that. there is darksoft pack of neo geo roms out there that has a bad Shock Troopers rom in it for example it happens when downloading they can become corrupt

The same ROM work almost well in MAME (where it was taken from) so I don't think it's a bad dump.

It has a minor glitch in MAME during the story which, ironically, doesn't happen in MiSTer.

Edit: It seems that I tend to have issues that other users don't have. I'm beginning to suspect that there's something wrong with my device.

[mr-box]

some times a bad corrupt rom will look like that. there is darksoft pack of neo geo roms out there that has a bad Shock Troopers rom in it for example it happens when downloading they can become corrupt

The same ROM work almost well in MAME (where it was taken from) so I don't think it's a bad dump.

It has a minor glitch in MAME during the story which, ironically, doesn't happen in MiSTer.

Edit: It seems that I tend to have issues that other users don't have. I'm beginning to suspect that there's something wrong with my device.

strange i dont have that problem like i said try a different rom

[XtraSmiley]

some times a bad corrupt rom will look like that. there is darksoft pack of neo geo roms out there that has a bad Shock Troopers rom in it for example it happens when downloading they can become corrupt

The same ROM work almost well in MAME (where it was taken from) so I don't think it's a bad dump.

It has a minor glitch in MAME during the story which, ironically, doesn't happen in MiSTer.

Edit: It seems that I tend to have issues that other users don't have. I'm beginning to suspect that there's something wrong with my device.

I'm not sure this would cause problems, but if the ROM works in MAME, try it on a different SD card.

[gibs]

The MiSTer core is extremely good, but definitely not perfect: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_MiSTer/issues

Correct me but most of those issues (if they are real) are < Feb 2020

You're not wrong...but they are definitely real. That should give you some idea of how much love the core doesn't get.

The core get enough love from people for not having to purchase a neogeo hardware.

I think this kind of "issues" https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/NeoGeo_ ... issues/132
is probably because the photo has been taken while the CRT has not finished to drawn the screen.

Let's get serious:
the neogeo screenshot comes from a LCD
the mister screenshot comes from a CRT

Do you know when this glitch happens ? I can't see it during the demo.