Problem displaying on CRT (Neo Geo Core)

[bvdh85]

Hi all,

After hours of trying, I'm stuck with the Neo Geo Core. I'm not able yet to display it properly. I've tried various settings in INI, not with a good result yet.

My setup is the following: HDMI out to VGA converter, VGA-> rgb scart cable (https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/ana ... earch=fpga) goes into a GscartW switch, which is connected via RGB scart on my B&O MX8000. The following other cores are running fine: TurboGrafx (incl. CD), SNES, NES, GBA, Genesis, Sega CD.

I am able to load a game and I hear also sound, so I assume I have the correct ROM files & BIOS files.

I think my specific Neo Geo settings aren't fully logical, but after many readings and tries I'm not still not sure in terms of logic, which setting is best to tweak.

In attachment there's a picture of the current display. When changing some video settings, I get other types of weird screens (like a vertically flickering output when loading the Core).

INI file:

[MiSTer]
key_menu_as_rgui=0 ; set to 1 to make the MENU key map to RGUI in Minimig (e.g. for Right Amiga)
forced_scandoubler=0 ; set to 1 to run scandoubler on VGA output always (depends on core).
ypbpr=0 ; set to 1 for YPbPr on VGA output.
composite_sync=1 ; set to 1 for composite sync on HSync signal of VGA output.
vga_scaler=0 ; set to 1 to connect VGA to scaler output.
hdmi_audio_96k=0 ; set to 1 for 96khz/16bit HDMI audio (48khz/16bit otherwise)
keyrah_mode=0x18d80002 ; VIDPID of keyrah for special code translation (0x23418037 for Arduino Micro)
vscale_mode=0 ; 0 - scale to fit the screen height.
; 1 - use integer scale only.
; 2 - use 0.5 steps of scale.
; 3 - use 0.25 steps of scale.
vscale_border=0 ; set vertical border for TVs cutting the upper/bottom parts of screen (1-399)
;bootscreen=0 ; uncomment to disable boot screen of some cores like Minimig.
;mouse_throttle=10 ; 1-100 mouse speed divider. Useful for very sensitive mice
rbf_hide_datecode=0 ; 1 - hides datecodes from rbf file names. Press F2 for quick temporary toggle
menu_pal=0 ; 1 - PAL mode for menu core
hdmi_limited=0 ; 1 - use limited (16..235) color range over HDMI
; 2 - use limited (16..255) color range over HDMI, for VGA converters.
direct_video=1 ; 1 - enable core video timing over HDMI, use only with VGA converters.
fb_size=0 ; 0 - automatic, 1 - full size, 2 - 1/2 of resolution, 4 - 1/4 of resolution.
fb_terminal=1 ; 1 - enabled (default), 0 - disabled
osd_timeout=30 ; 5-3600 timeout (in seconds) for OSD to disappear in Menu core. 30 seconds if not set.
; Background picture will get darker after double timeout
osd_rotate=0 ; Display OSD menu rotated, 0 - no rotation, 1 - rotate right (+90°), 2 - rotate left (-90°)

; 1 - enables the recent file loaded/mounted.
; WARNING: This option will enable write to SD card on every load/mount which may wear the SD card after many writes to the same place
; There is also higher chance to corrupt the File System if MiSTer will be reset or powered off while writing.
recents=0

; lastcore - Autoboot the last loaded core (corename autosaved in CONFIG/lastcore.dat) first found on the SD/USB
; lastexactcore - Autoboot the last loaded exact core (corename_yyyymmdd.rbf autosaved in CONFIG/lastcore.dat) first found on the SD/USB
; corename - Autoboot first corename_*.rbf found on the SD/USB
; corename_yyyymmdd.rbf - Autoboot first corename_yyyymmdd.rbf found on the SD/USB
;bootcore=lastcore ; uncomment to autoboot a core, as the last loaded core.

; 10-30 timeout before autoboot, comment for autoboot without timeout.
bootcore_timeout=10

; Option to load the custom font. Format is plain bitmap 8x8.
; Supported sizes of font:
; 768 bytes - chars 32-127 (only alpha + numeric)
; 1024 bytes - chars 0-127
; 1136 bytes - chars 0-141
; up to 2048 - only chars 0-141 will be used.
; if first 32 chars are empty (for sizes 1024 bytes and more) then they are skipped.
font=font/myfont.pf

; USER button emulation by keybaord. Usually it's reset button.
; 0 - lctrl+lalt+ralt (lctrl+lgui+rgui on keyrah)
; 1 - lctrl+lgui+rgui
; 2 - lctrl+lalt+del
; 3 - same as 0 (lctrl+lalt+ralt on keyrah)
reset_combo=0

; set to 1 for DVI mode. Audio won't be transmitted through HDMI in DVI mode.
dvi_mode=0

; 0 - 1280x720@60
; 1 - 1024x768@60
; 2 - 720x480@60
; 3 - 720x576@50
; 4 - 1280x1024@60
; 5 - 800x600@60
; 6 - 640x480@60
; 7 - 1280x720@50
; 8 - 1920x1080@60
; 9 - 1920x1080@50
;10 - 1366x768@60
;11 - 1024x600@60
;12 - 1920x1440@60
;13 - 2048x1536@60
;
; custom mode: hact,hfp,hs,hbp,vact,vfp,vs,vbp,Fpix_in_KHz
; video_mode=1280,110,40,220,720,5,5,20,74250
video_mode=0

; set to 1-10 (seconds) to display video info on startup/change
video_info=10

; Set to 1 for automatic HDMI VSync rate adjust to match original VSync.
; Set to 2 for low latency mode (single buffer).
; This option makes video butter smooth like on original emulated system.
; Adjusting is done by changing pixel clock. Not every display supports variable pixel clock.
; For proper adjusting and to reduce possible out of range pixel clock, use 60Hz HDMI video
; modes as a base even for 50Hz systems.
vsync_adjust=0

; If you monitor doesn't support either very low (NTSC monitors may not support PAL) or
; very high (PAL monitors may not support NTSC) then you can set refresh_min and/or refresh_max
; parameters, so vsync_adjust won't be applied for refreshes outside specified.
; These parameters are valid only when vsync_adjust is non-zero.
refresh_min=0
refresh_max=0

; These parameters have the same format as video_mode.
; You need to supply both PAL and NTSC modes if you want vsync_adjust to switch between
; predefined modes as a base. This will reduce the range of pixel clock.
;video_mode_ntsc=0
;video_mode_pal=7

; 1-10 (seconds) to display controller's button map upon first time key press
; 0 - disable
controller_info=6

; JammaSD/J-PAC/I-PAC keys to joysticks translation
; You have to provide correct VID and PID of your input device
; Examples: Legacy J-PAC with Mini-USB or USB capable I-PAC with PS/2 connectors VID=0xD209/PID=0x0301
; USB Capable J-PAC with only PS/2 connectors VID=0x04B4/PID=0x0101
; JammaSD: VID=0x04D8/PID=0xF3AD
jamma_vid=0x04D8
jamma_pid=0xF3AD

; Disable merging input devices. Use if only player 1 works.
; Leave no_merge_pid empty to apply this to all devices with the same VID.
;no_merge_vid=0x045E
;no_merge_pid=0x028E

; Same as above but can add multiple devices (one entry per VIDPID). Format is VIDPID in hex number
;no_merge_vidpid=0x12345678
;no_merge_vidpid=0x11112222

; Speeds in sniper/non-sniper modes of mouse emulation by joystick
; 0 - (default) - faster move in non-sniper mode, slower move in sniper mode.
; 1 - movement speeds are swapped.
sniper_mode=0

; Uncomment following option if you don't want to see a second line for long file names in listing.
;browse_expand=0

; 0 - disable MiSTer logo in Menu core
logo=1

; Custom shared folder for core supporting this feature (currently minimig and ao486 only)
; Can be relative to core's home dir or absolute path.
; Path must exist before core start to use it, or it will fail.
; Make sure USB device is mounted before use shared folder on USB!
shared_folder=

; Custom aspect ratio
;custom_aspect_ratio_1=16:10
;custom_aspect_ratio_2=1:1

; use specific (VID/PID) mouse X movement as a spinner and paddle. Use VID=0xFFFF/PID=0xFFFF to use all mice as spinners.
;spinner_vid=0x1BCF
;spinner_pid=0x0005

; spinner_throttle with base value 100 gives one spinner step per one tick. Higher value makes spinner slower.
; Lower than 100 makes spinner faster. Negative value gives opposite direction.
;spinner_throttle=-50

; 0 - X axis, 1 - Y axis.
;spinner_axis=1

; Default filters for video scaler and audio. Paths must be relative to scaler/audio filter folder without leading slash.
;vfilter_default=LCD Effects/LCD_Effect_07.txt
;afilter_default=LPF2000_3tap.txt

; Defines internal joypad mapping from virtual SNES mapping in main to core mapping
; Set to 0 for name mapping (jn) (e.g. A button in SNES core = A button on controller regardless of position on pad)
; Set to 1 for positional mapping (jp) (e.g. A button in SNES core = East button on controller regardless of button name)
gamepad_defaults=0

; Write out file name under the cursor in browser for external integration
; External application or script may parse the info and do some additional actions and/or send info to 3rd party server.
; Warning: it may slowdown the system or add lag while browsing the files in OSD depending on external app/script.
log_file_entry=0

; Automatically disconnect (and shutdown) Bluetooth input device if not use specified amount of time.
; Some controllers have no automatic shutdown built in and will keep connection till battery dry out.
; 0 - don't disconnect automatically, otherwise it's amount of minutes.
bt_auto_disconnect=0

[NeoGeo]
direct_video=0
vga_scaler=1
vsync_adjust=2
vscale_mode=2

[FoxbatStargazer]

When you're using direct_video there isn't that much you can do to change the video. The MVS has an unusually low refresh of around 59.2hz which your TV or converter may be incompatible with. I think there was a change this month to make AES mode use the original AES clocks, where NTSC was closer to 59.6hz. You might try to see if you can flip it over to AES mode and launch a game.

[bvdh85]

Both MVS and AES are having the same result unfortunately.

I dont fully understand your remark concerning direct_video, I explicitely setted in INI that to zero in this specific core at the bottom of my file. Maybe I putted that not correctly, but my purpose is to enable direct video for all cores except neo geo.

[FoxbatStargazer]

Oh! Sorry. Well then, isn't the problem that you are sending it video mode 0, which is 720p? If its a Standard Definition set it won't be able to display that. You're going to need a custom modeline that is 320x240 or some higher multiple of that width for neo geo.

[bvdh85]

Do I need a customized video mode for that? I have tried some ones of these which I found on this forum, but I am not sure which one is fitting properly the 320x240 resolution.

[FoxbatStargazer]

Try making some modelines with this tool: https://tomverbeure.github.io/video_timings_calculator

Format is H Pixels, H Front Porch, H Sync, H Back Porch, V Pixels, V Front Porch, V Sync, V Back Porch, Pixel Clock x 1000.

I would start with 240p but you can also try 224p or 244p. For width I would start with 1920, too low a width and you will be below spec for the converter.

[bvdh85]

Think I got it, so I need to input the outcome of the calculator in that format e.g. with a 320x240 resolution. Will try some things with this, thx

[akeley]

NoeGeo should work on the same settings that most of the other cores, without any special modelines or tweaks (if we forget about the 320px overscan debacle for the sake of this case). At least it does that on my setup which is very similar to yours.

If it really doesn't work this way, you can try the config/modeline from this thread: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3238
Or some tips on how to tweak them: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3238

[hiddenbyleaves]

Have you checked to see if your core specific config has no scandoubler mode on?

[bvdh85]

The scandoubler fix is set to none, so that should be the correct setting in the core options I suppose?

Thx all for your reply, I will try to change my settings accordingly.

[hiddenbyleaves]

The scandoubler fix is set to none, so that should be the correct setting in the core options I suppose?

Thx all for your reply, I will try to change my settings accordingly.

When I first hooked my mister up to my crt the genesis core would not sync. I eventually realised that I had messed around with the scandoubler once while it was hooked up to hdmi on that core. It had saved the setting and was overriding the general core options.

[bvdh85]

Tried to make progress, but no succes yet unfortuately. I think the direct_video route is still possible, because I got the ao486 working this way yesterday (also posted on this forum).

I tried different video modes, but I'm not sure whether that the setting is to solve. To be clear, my tv is 15khz (further setup is in first post explained).

I'm getting a vertically 'flickering' screen with these current settings (see attachments).

Any further help would be appreciated


INI:

[MiSTer]
key_menu_as_rgui=0 ; set to 1 to make the MENU key map to RGUI in Minimig (e.g. for Right Amiga)
forced_scandoubler=0 ; set to 1 to run scandoubler on VGA output always (depends on core).
ypbpr=0 ; set to 1 for YPbPr on VGA output.
composite_sync=1 ; set to 1 for composite sync on HSync signal of VGA output.
vga_scaler=0 ; set to 1 to connect VGA to scaler output.
hdmi_audio_96k=0 ; set to 1 for 96khz/16bit HDMI audio (48khz/16bit otherwise)
keyrah_mode=0x18d80002 ; VIDPID of keyrah for special code translation (0x23418037 for Arduino Micro)
vscale_mode=0 ; 0 - scale to fit the screen height.
; 1 - use integer scale only.
; 2 - use 0.5 steps of scale.
; 3 - use 0.25 steps of scale.
vscale_border=0 ; set vertical border for TVs cutting the upper/bottom parts of screen (1-399)
;bootscreen=0 ; uncomment to disable boot screen of some cores like Minimig.
;mouse_throttle=10 ; 1-100 mouse speed divider. Useful for very sensitive mice
rbf_hide_datecode=0 ; 1 - hides datecodes from rbf file names. Press F2 for quick temporary toggle
menu_pal=0 ; 1 - PAL mode for menu core
hdmi_limited=0 ; 1 - use limited (16..235) color range over HDMI
; 2 - use limited (16..255) color range over HDMI, for VGA converters.
direct_video=1 ; 1 - enable core video timing over HDMI, use only with VGA converters.
fb_size=0 ; 0 - automatic, 1 - full size, 2 - 1/2 of resolution, 4 - 1/4 of resolution.
fb_terminal=1 ; 1 - enabled (default), 0 - disabled
osd_timeout=30 ; 5-3600 timeout (in seconds) for OSD to disappear in Menu core. 30 seconds if not set.
; Background picture will get darker after double timeout
osd_rotate=0 ; Display OSD menu rotated, 0 - no rotation, 1 - rotate right (+90°), 2 - rotate left (-90°)

; 1 - enables the recent file loaded/mounted.
; WARNING: This option will enable write to SD card on every load/mount which may wear the SD card after many writes to the same place
; There is also higher chance to corrupt the File System if MiSTer will be reset or powered off while writing.
recents=0

; lastcore - Autoboot the last loaded core (corename autosaved in CONFIG/lastcore.dat) first found on the SD/USB
; lastexactcore - Autoboot the last loaded exact core (corename_yyyymmdd.rbf autosaved in CONFIG/lastcore.dat) first found on the SD/USB
; corename - Autoboot first corename_*.rbf found on the SD/USB
; corename_yyyymmdd.rbf - Autoboot first corename_yyyymmdd.rbf found on the SD/USB
;bootcore=lastcore ; uncomment to autoboot a core, as the last loaded core.

; 10-30 timeout before autoboot, comment for autoboot without timeout.
bootcore_timeout=10

; Option to load the custom font. Format is plain bitmap 8x8.
; Supported sizes of font:
; 768 bytes - chars 32-127 (only alpha + numeric)
; 1024 bytes - chars 0-127
; 1136 bytes - chars 0-141
; up to 2048 - only chars 0-141 will be used.
; if first 32 chars are empty (for sizes 1024 bytes and more) then they are skipped.
font=font/myfont.pf

; USER button emulation by keybaord. Usually it's reset button.
; 0 - lctrl+lalt+ralt (lctrl+lgui+rgui on keyrah)
; 1 - lctrl+lgui+rgui
; 2 - lctrl+lalt+del
; 3 - same as 0 (lctrl+lalt+ralt on keyrah)
reset_combo=0

; set to 1 for DVI mode. Audio won't be transmitted through HDMI in DVI mode.
dvi_mode=0

; 0 - 1280x720@60
; 1 - 1024x768@60
; 2 - 720x480@60
; 3 - 720x576@50
; 4 - 1280x1024@60
; 5 - 800x600@60
; 6 - 640x480@60
; 7 - 1280x720@50
; 8 - 1920x1080@60
; 9 - 1920x1080@50
;10 - 1366x768@60
;11 - 1024x600@60
;12 - 1920x1440@60
;13 - 2048x1536@60
;
; custom mode: hact,hfp,hs,hbp,vact,vfp,vs,vbp,Fpix_in_KHz
; video_mode=1280,110,40,220,720,5,5,20,74250
video_mode=0

; set to 1-10 (seconds) to display video info on startup/change
video_info=10

; Set to 1 for automatic HDMI VSync rate adjust to match original VSync.
; Set to 2 for low latency mode (single buffer).
; This option makes video butter smooth like on original emulated system.
; Adjusting is done by changing pixel clock. Not every display supports variable pixel clock.
; For proper adjusting and to reduce possible out of range pixel clock, use 60Hz HDMI video
; modes as a base even for 50Hz systems.
vsync_adjust=0

; If you monitor doesn't support either very low (NTSC monitors may not support PAL) or
; very high (PAL monitors may not support NTSC) then you can set refresh_min and/or refresh_max
; parameters, so vsync_adjust won't be applied for refreshes outside specified.
; These parameters are valid only when vsync_adjust is non-zero.
refresh_min=0
refresh_max=0

; These parameters have the same format as video_mode.
; You need to supply both PAL and NTSC modes if you want vsync_adjust to switch between
; predefined modes as a base. This will reduce the range of pixel clock.
;video_mode_ntsc=0
;video_mode_pal=7

; 1-10 (seconds) to display controller's button map upon first time key press
; 0 - disable
controller_info=6

; JammaSD/J-PAC/I-PAC keys to joysticks translation
; You have to provide correct VID and PID of your input device
; Examples: Legacy J-PAC with Mini-USB or USB capable I-PAC with PS/2 connectors VID=0xD209/PID=0x0301
; USB Capable J-PAC with only PS/2 connectors VID=0x04B4/PID=0x0101
; JammaSD: VID=0x04D8/PID=0xF3AD
jamma_vid=0x04D8
jamma_pid=0xF3AD

; Disable merging input devices. Use if only player 1 works.
; Leave no_merge_pid empty to apply this to all devices with the same VID.
;no_merge_vid=0x045E
;no_merge_pid=0x028E

; Same as above but can add multiple devices (one entry per VIDPID). Format is VIDPID in hex number
;no_merge_vidpid=0x12345678
;no_merge_vidpid=0x11112222

; Speeds in sniper/non-sniper modes of mouse emulation by joystick
; 0 - (default) - faster move in non-sniper mode, slower move in sniper mode.
; 1 - movement speeds are swapped.
sniper_mode=0

; Uncomment following option if you don't want to see a second line for long file names in listing.
;browse_expand=0

; 0 - disable MiSTer logo in Menu core
logo=1

; Custom shared folder for core supporting this feature (currently minimig and ao486 only)
; Can be relative to core's home dir or absolute path.
; Path must exist before core start to use it, or it will fail.
; Make sure USB device is mounted before use shared folder on USB!
shared_folder=

; Custom aspect ratio
;custom_aspect_ratio_1=16:10
;custom_aspect_ratio_2=1:1

; use specific (VID/PID) mouse X movement as a spinner and paddle. Use VID=0xFFFF/PID=0xFFFF to use all mice as spinners.
;spinner_vid=0x1BCF
;spinner_pid=0x0005

; spinner_throttle with base value 100 gives one spinner step per one tick. Higher value makes spinner slower.
; Lower than 100 makes spinner faster. Negative value gives opposite direction.
;spinner_throttle=-50

; 0 - X axis, 1 - Y axis.
;spinner_axis=1

; Default filters for video scaler and audio. Paths must be relative to scaler/audio filter folder without leading slash.
;vfilter_default=LCD Effects/LCD_Effect_07.txt
;afilter_default=LPF2000_3tap.txt

; Defines internal joypad mapping from virtual SNES mapping in main to core mapping
; Set to 0 for name mapping (jn) (e.g. A button in SNES core = A button on controller regardless of position on pad)
; Set to 1 for positional mapping (jp) (e.g. A button in SNES core = East button on controller regardless of button name)
gamepad_defaults=0

; Write out file name under the cursor in browser for external integration
; External application or script may parse the info and do some additional actions and/or send info to 3rd party server.
; Warning: it may slowdown the system or add lag while browsing the files in OSD depending on external app/script.
log_file_entry=0

; Automatically disconnect (and shutdown) Bluetooth input device if not use specified amount of time.
; Some controllers have no automatic shutdown built in and will keep connection till battery dry out.
; 0 - don't disconnect automatically, otherwise it's amount of minutes.
bt_auto_disconnect=0

[ao486]
vscale_mode=0
vscale_border=1
video_mode=640,8,58,78,240,1,3,18,12324
;video_mode=640,0,58,86,240,1,3,18,12324
;video_mode=1280,132,140,281,240,15,0,19,30133
;video_mode=720,24,64,88,240,3,10,6,13500
;video_mode=640,55,90,131,200,34,0,40,15058
;video_mode=640,65,60,108,224,16,0,26,13919
;video_mode=640,54,56,106,224,16,0,28,13764
;video_mode=640,6,56,66,224,14,8,18,12000
;video_mode=640,16,64,80,240,1,3,14,12380

[NeoGeo]
video_mode=320,7,28,29,224,16,8,16,6000

[FoxbatStargazer]

Just remember that if you are using direct_video, as it looks like you are in this ini, video_mode should be basically ignored. So changing those settings won't do anything while direct_video is active.

Each core has its own resolution settings for direct video, and they are often oddly wide like 2000 or even 3000. Its possible some of them won't be compatible with your converter. AO486 in particular has a relatively narrow direct resolution compared to most cores, which might even make it more compatible...

[paulbnl]

You can try this rbf which has been changed to 60.00Hz. viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1438

Vertical flickering means your CRT might not like the refresh rate of the standard NeoGeo core.

[bvdh85]

Problem is solved, by replacing the RBF like mentioned in viewtopic.php?f=23&t=1438

Looks amazing on direct video, no specific settings tweaked.

Thanks all for the help!