HDMI to Component (for old JVC CRT TV)

[eightbit]

So this weekend I scored a pretty nice working 32inch JVC CRT TV circa 2003. It has component connections which I have tested with a component ready DVD player and the picture looks great.

Now time to get my MiSTer to it. I am aware of the ini settings that will need to be changed, not a problem. But I am curious as to what adapter or cable to buy. I have the digital IO board that does NOT have the VGA port, so I must use the DE10-NANO's HDMI for direct video....which I hear is not a problem.

I was looking at this adapter:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PMGBVV8/

Will this work? Or does anyone have another recommendation that they have tested working fine for HDMI to Component to an old TV?

Any help is appreciated!

[akeley]

Wiki says to use HDMI-VGA converter, not HDMI-Component. Maybe it will work, but I personally wouldn't risk it.

When looking for my HDMI-VGA DAC I typed in the search the name of the recommended chip - AG6200...just to be on the safe side.

Then you'll need an appropriately modded cable, check the wiki for details.

[amadama]

I use the I/O board for component output but on a whim I tried out the following HDMI to Component adapter:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B082HT11MH

It displays a picture but the colors are off, kind of greenish. With ypbpr settings on ini to 0, it gives better colors but I get a rolling picture.

[Sigismond0]

Have you tried flipping the SOG switch?

[amadama]

Have you tried flipping the SOG switch?

The SOG switch is for the I/O board. I was testing direct_video via the HDMI output.

[Sigismond0]

Gotcha. Probably the same issue though. When using a VGA adapter, you have to do a mod to the adapter to enable SoG through it, so you might need to do something similar for the component cable.

[eightbit]

I went ahead and ordered that adapter I linked in the beginning of this thread and it is supposed to arrive tomorrow. No skin off my nose if it does not work as I can always return it. I am just curious to see if it actually works. I will update with my results.


EDIT: And, it didn't work I didn't expect it to and have the Rankie HDMI to VGA on order along with VGA to component cable, but I was curious and wanted to see what happens. Well, now we all know

[amadama]

Which component cable did you order?

[eightbit]

Which component cable did you order?

I ordered this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ZMV7RL2/

and this (as a comment in the reviews from someone specifically called out that it worked with the MiSTer....more people should do that!):

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07F3WVV99/


I am fairly certain this combo will work as I have seen many reported that the Rankie adapter is compatible. I spent a lot of time in forum threads before ordering these as I want to make sure I get it right and move on with using this on a CRT. Pretty excited about that!

[amadama]

I have those same exact items for my Mister. The HDMI to VGA adapter I use for hooking up to a Dell 2001fp monitor and the cable I use for my I/O board to go to a Component input on a TV. Hope you can get the combination to work for HDMI-Component.

[ioev]

I still think it would be great if the Analogue DAC signal spec was opened up so that other devices (MiSTer?) could support it.

[GusCrt]

Very interesting topic. Anyone knows why the hdmi to vga works and for component doesn't? I am just looking for a component output for my crt :/ so sad that zero lag hdmi2component doesnt work, my dream its a 240p signal with conponent cable haha im knew to the mister system, someone knows how to output component signal with no lag?

[thorr]

Very interesting topic. Anyone knows why the hdmi to vga works and for component doesn't? I am just looking for a component output for my crt :/ so sad that zero lag hdmi2component doesnt work, my dream its a 240p signal with conponent cable haha im knew to the mister system, someone knows how to output component signal with no lag?

This works great for me:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224222036088

[Yodasghost]

This works great for me:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224222036088

Do you know if this adds any lag on the vga or component?

[thorr]

This works great for me:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224222036088

Do you know if this adds any lag on the vga or component?

Edit: This is not the same product. They updated the ebay listing, and now this converts TO HDMI, not from HDMI (wrong direction). The original product had zero lag. It worked with Duck Hunt which is the perfect lag test.

[elvis]

Mike Chi (RetroTink designer) designed this product, and open sourced it. He's not producing it commercially, but there's a few people making and selling them I think.

https://www.retrotink.com/post/vga2ntsc-released

You need to feed it 15KHz RGBHV, as it won't down scale, but obviously the MiSTer does that fine. The "VGA" portion of the name is a little misleading, as the physical plug is a DE15 connector that expects RGBHV, but it won't work with VGA spec 31KHz resolutions.

There's a SCART connector on it too.

[Yodasghost]

Mike Chi (RetroTink designer) designed this product, and open sourced it. He's not producing it commercially, but there's a few people making and selling them I think.

https://www.retrotink.com/post/vga2ntsc-released

You need to feed it 15KHz RGBHV, as it won't down scale, but obviously the MiSTer does that fine. The "VGA" portion of the name is a little misleading, as the physical plug is a DE15 connector that expects RGBHV, but it won't work with VGA spec 31KHz resolutions.

There's a SCART connector on it too.

Ah thanks,
Yeah I stumbled across this recently too I can't seem to find a seller who has them in stock at th uk atm though

[Phaedrus]

Which component cable did you order?

I ordered this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ZMV7RL2/

and this (as a comment in the reviews from someone specifically called out that it worked with the MiSTer....more people should do that!):

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07F3WVV99/


I am fairly certain this combo will work as I have seen many reported that the Rankie adapter is compatible. I spent a lot of time in forum threads before ordering these as I want to make sure I get it right and move on with using this on a CRT. Pretty excited about that!

Did this combo work?

[thorr]

I think you need to do a Sync on Green (SOG) mod in order for that to work.

[FoxbatStargazer]

These HDMI->VGA are likely to push out RGBHV, and those cables with VGA on one end and component on the other are mere breakout cables, they just route the color pins to the appropriate cables. Because HV sync is separate pins from the colors on VGA the breakout cable is just going to discard that sync. On mister's VGA port you can flip the SoG switch to push sync through Luma but that only applies to its own VGA port and AFAIK cannot be pushed through the HDMI output somehow.

Portta has zero-lag powered converter boxes that go both directions for HDMI and Component, if you want something cheap that will take care of sync. Just set direct_video=1 and you should be set.

[Phaedrus]

I think you need to do a Sync on Green (SOG) mod in order for that to work.

That's what I'm gathering. The wiki describes the mod, but I'm not really sure how to proceed with it. I can't find any examples of it being done in practice. I can get the parts and solder it, but I'm not sure how to... arrange it?

[Phaedrus]

These HDMI->VGA are likely to push out RGBHV, and those cables with VGA on one end and component on the other are mere breakout cables, they just route the color pins to the appropriate cables. Because HV sync is separate pins from the colors on VGA the breakout cable is just going to discard that sync. On mister's VGA port you can flip the SoG switch to push sync through Luma but that only applies to its own VGA port and AFAIK cannot be pushed through the HDMI output somehow.

Portta has zero-lag powered converter boxes that go both directions for HDMI and Component, if you want something cheap that will take care of sync. Just set direct_video=1 and you should be set.

I have that Portta HDMI -> Component converter box and so far I haven't been able to get it to work, but maybe it's just a config thing. I'll try a few more things I guess.

Long story short, I have a mister with digital io board because I never thought I'd get my hands on a CRT and then of course 2 months later I get the chance to pick up a JVC AV-27230 w/ component input in great condition for cheap and in my neighbourhood. I thought great, I'll just use direct video out, but that's apparently not as straightforward for component. So far the Portta HDMI to component didn't work, but I only got it and the CRT yesterday. Today the Portta HDMI to VGA adapter and a VGA to component cable has arrived, but that needs the mod apparently. I decided to just throw the kitchen sink at it and I have a analog i/o board arriving tomorrow as well. So one way or another I'll have something displaying on it soon enough.

Here's what I'm working with so far for anyone else that comes along in future. I'll update with what eventually works.

VGA to component cable: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B001T6OHNU/
Portta HDMI -> VGA converter: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003O55U8K/
Portta HDMI -> Component converter: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00A8FIQXA/
Component cable: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B003L150CS/

[Phaedrus]

So after a little more ini tweaking I got the Portta HDMI -> Component converter to kind of work. The main boot menu works fine, but once you load a core the screen flickers and jitters like there's a sync problem. But the colors are fine and the main menu is solid.

Here's the ini I used edited down to just the relevant video settings after looking at some of @Thorr s settings from here: viewtopic.php?p=18208#p18208

[MiSTer]
forced_scandoubler=0 ; set to 1 to run scandoubler on VGA output always (depends on core).
ypbpr=0 ; set to 1 for YPbPr on VGA output.
composite_sync=0 ; set to 1 for composite sync on HSync signal of VGA output.
vga_scaler=0 ; set to 1 to connect VGA to scaler output.
vscale_mode=0 ; 0 - scale to fit the screen height.
vscale_border=0 ; set vertical border for TVs cutting the upper/bottom parts of screen (1-399)
hdmi_limited=2 ; 2 - use limited (16..255) color range over HDMI, for VGA converters.
direct_video=1 ; 1 - enable core video timing over HDMI, use only with VGA converters.
dvi_mode=0 ; set to 1 for DVI mode. Audio wont be transmitted through HDMI in DVI mode.
;CRT TV
video_mode=640,30,60,70,240,4,4,14,12587 ; Menu timings on direct_video=1
vsync_adjust=2 ; vsync_adjust=2 single/sub-single buffer (0-1 frame), native systems refresh, synced
refresh_min=57
refresh_max=62
video_mode_ntsc=8
video_mode_pal=9

I tried changing the VGA scaler and vsync settings but it had no effect. Any suggestions on what to change to solve that weird flicker? Maybe it's the video_mode timings are wrong?

Now to try the HDMI -> VGA converter with the VGA -> component cable.

[Phaedrus]

Even less luck with the HDMI -> VGA converter with the VGA -> component cable. Just a brief flash of the menu screen the first time I powered it up. Nothing after that. Slight screen flicker when the mister is turned on, but other than that, nothing. Not even a pink image. Tried the same settings as above and also with:

ypbpr=1 ; set to 1 for YPbPr on VGA output.
composite_sync=1 ; set to 1 for composite sync on HSync signal of VGA output.

Might just have to wait for the analog i/o board tomorrow.

[FoxbatStargazer]

The VGA->component breakout cable has the exact problem I warned you about, there is no sync signal passing through it, when you need sync on green/luma. Although when you get your I/O board you should be able to use it with that at least, the physical SoG switch will take care of your sync and then you just set ypbpr=1.

Not sure why the Portta isn't working for you, its possible that it can't handle the super-wide direct resolutions in those cores. I would give ao486 core a try since it has a narrower direct_video setting than most. (But to use direct-video you probably need to change in the ao486 HUD menu the refresh rate to 60hz.)

[Phaedrus]

I'll have to look into the sync on green mod a little deeper. I still haven't found a practical example of it in action.

I'll have to do some more testing with the Portta component converter. It looks like it was going to be a slam dunk. I'll try some more settings tweaks and see if any core will work with it without the rolling flicker.

I haven't got the ao486 set up yet as I have far less interest there than in the console and arcade cores, but might be worth a try as a test of your theory.

[FoxbatStargazer]

You could also try turning off direct_video and instead use vga_scaler and some custom video modelines on cores. Like on genesis core, try 320x240, or more likely multiples of 320 (maybe 1920x240). This way you have fine control to try and identify what is going on with the portta. If you manage to get something that syncs, set aspect ratio to full in the HUD you can play games that way too.

If you are getting a 6.1 analog I/O board the SoG switch should be built in. Its specifically for getting the sync pulse on green/luma, which is the standard for component video, however it only applies to the VGA port on the I/O board. When you connect that VGA->component breakout cable you listed, SoG will make the sync pulse travel down the green cable and get your TV picture to stop rolling.

[Phaedrus]

Thanks. I'll try the custom video modelines. So far everything I have tried has not worked to get a stable image (outside of the menu core)

I'm not 100% sure what i/o board version will be coming. I chose the only amazon.ca seller that had next day shipping. The image shows v6.0 but who knows what will actually arrive.

[Phaedrus]

No matter what settings I use with the HDMI to component converter the resolution always shows as 640x240. Maybe that's part of the problem with this thing.

[Phaedrus]

Oh my god. I feel so stupid. I didn't turn direct video off when using the HDMI>component converter. With direct video off it does seem to work.