MiSTer FPGA Forum

Posted: **Wed Mar 16, 2022 5:56 pm**

Ah I see. Maybe if you download it and send it to PCBWay or (Insert random YouTube PCB sponsor here) they would create it for you?

Posted: **Wed Mar 16, 2022 7:41 pm**

is available somewhere a ready to burn pi zero 2 mt32-pi image? thanks

Posted: **Wed Mar 16, 2022 9:41 pm**

Juri wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 7:41 pm is available somewhere a ready to burn pi zero 2 mt32-pi image? thanks

https://github.com/dwhinham/mt32-pi/releases

Posted: **Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:35 pm**

Juri wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 4:30 pm i meant the bare pcb, without components

I've had a large number of requests over the last couple of weeks for the mt32-pi lite PCB set, so I have just added them to my website for sale. The most difficult part for this build is actually finding an Raspberry Pi Zero 2 W in stock for a fair price!

See here:

mt32-pi lite PCB set for MiSTer

Posted: **Thu Mar 17, 2022 1:34 pm**

Nat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:35 pm
Juri wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 4:30 pm i meant the bare pcb, without components
I've had a large number of requests over the last couple of weeks for the mt32-pi lite PCB set, so I have just added them to my website for sale. The most difficult part for this build is actually finding an Raspberry Pi Zero 2 W in stock for a fair price!

See here:

mt32-pi lite PCB set for MiSTer

had a look at it, but i'm look at the version with lcd and buttons. i would like to integrate it in my MiSTer computer case.
thanks

Posted: **Tue Mar 22, 2022 12:32 pm**

The hard work to get perfect sc-55 sound(font) continues with a new project:
https://github.com/skjelten/emusc

Possible support for mt32-pi
https://github.com/skjelten/emusc/issues/1

Posted: **Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:00 pm**

Juri wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 4:30 pm
cursedverses wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 3:26 pm
Juri wrote: ↑Tue Mar 08, 2022 10:33 am Hi anyone is selling this pcb?
thank
https://ultimatemister.com/product/mt32 ... or-mister/
i meant the bare pcb, without components

My friend Juri, hope you are fine. I can provide you any pcb you need as always. Check your phone message

Posted: **Sat Apr 09, 2022 7:52 am**

rickdangerous wrote: ↑Tue Apr 05, 2022 9:00 pm
Juri wrote: ↑Wed Mar 16, 2022 4:30 pm
cursedverses wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 3:26 pm

https://ultimatemister.com/product/mt32 ... or-mister/
i meant the bare pcb, without components
My friend Juri, hope you are fine. I can provide you any pcb you need as always. Check your phone message

Thank you so much! Things are a little bit better now, sorry my friend, didn't realized who you are by your nickname. Thanks so much!

Posted: **Tue Jun 14, 2022 3:35 pm**

Xbytez wrote: ↑Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:50 pm
Update from Dale on the Pi Zero 2 W.

Just saw this, and had to reply:https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=88440
Could we switch between MT32 and GUS ?

PiGUS: Gravis Ultrasound emulator on an ISA card with Raspberry Pi

Posted: **Wed Jun 15, 2022 7:11 am**

held wrote: ↑Tue Jun 14, 2022 3:35 pm Just saw this, and had to reply:https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=88440
Could we switch between MT32 and GUS ?

PiGUS: Gravis Ultrasound emulator on an ISA card with Raspberry Pi

I believe PiGUS and MT32-Pi are using the same baremetal boot environment so I could see how it might potentially work on the same device. But I guess the question becomes: is the PiGUS needed? I didn't own a Gravis Ultrasound so I may be misinformed but I thought the main OPL synthesizer output wasn't any different from SoundBlaster cards; just different quality. The main difference was the sound of its General MIDI and that part can be replicated by a decently made SoundFont loaded into FluidSynth (eawpats seems to be a well made one). Is there something a dedicated GUS emulator would bring to MiSTer that the MT32-Pi can't already do?

Posted: **Wed Jun 15, 2022 11:55 am**

One of the reasons the MT32-Pi works is because MIDI is serial. That means two lines going out for the MIDI signal, and two lines coming back for the digital audio. I'm pretty sure the GUS uses DMA and has a real address space on the bus, far more than the single port 330 for MIDI, so it's not going to interface easily with the four lines being used on the USB cable.

Maybe they could use a bunch of GPIO pins to run a pretend ISA bus, but I don't think there's enough left. I think almost all of them are already in use.

This sounds like something that would be better served by an actual vintage PC with an ISA slot or two; the PiGUS might be a nice replacement for the original cards, which are quite rare.

Posted: **Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:29 pm**

DevilHunterWolf wrote: ↑Wed Jun 15, 2022 7:11 am
I believe PiGUS and MT32-Pi are using the same baremetal boot environment so I could see how it might potentially work on the same device. But I guess the question becomes: is the PiGUS needed? I didn't own a Gravis Ultrasound so I may be misinformed but I thought the main OPL synthesizer output wasn't any different from SoundBlaster cards; just different quality. The main difference was the sound of its General MIDI and that part can be replicated by a decently made SoundFont loaded into FluidSynth (eawpats seems to be a well made one). Is there something a dedicated GUS emulator would bring to MiSTer that the MT32-Pi can't already do?

Yeah, it was the best soundcard for trackers and very liked by the demoscene. And some sound so much better than with the SoundBlaster like Duke3D. I think vogons has a list of all UltraSound games, but I cant remember where.

Malor wrote: ↑Wed Jun 15, 2022 11:55 am
One of the reasons the MT32-Pi works is because MIDI is serial. That means two lines going out for the MIDI signal, and two lines coming back for the digital audio. I'm pretty sure the GUS uses DMA and has a real address space on the bus, far more than the single port 330 for MIDI, so it's not going to interface easily with the four lines being used on the USB cable.

Maybe they could use a bunch of GPIO pins to run a pretend ISA bus, but I don't think there's enough left. I think almost all of them are already in use.

This sounds like something that would be better served by an actual vintage PC with an ISA slot or two; the PiGUS might be a nice replacement for the original cards, which are quite rare.

https://youtu.be/watch?v=TWeWGiMYwsE

And you can order it here if you are interested:
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=42431

Posted: **Wed Jun 15, 2022 10:24 pm**

Is that video in the tweet still relevant today? I was hoping that the PiZero2 would be powerful enough to fully replace a Pi4 as a MT32-Pi, but it's sad to hear that with games that have more complex soundtracks you would need an overclock to pull that off. I wasn't aware the Pi4 was just barely managing it.

Posted: **Thu Jun 16, 2022 7:36 am**

held wrote: ↑Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:29 pm https://youtu.be/watch?v=TWeWGiMYwsE

And you can order it here if you are interested:
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?f=62&t=42431

Ooh, that's pretty neat. If I ever lay hands on an old desktop again, I'll have to check that out.

Posted: **Sun Jun 19, 2022 2:08 pm**

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Wed Jun 15, 2022 10:24 pm I was hoping that the PiZero2 would be powerful enough to fully replace a Pi4 as a MT32-Pi, but it's sad to hear that with games that have more complex soundtracks you would need an overclock to pull that off.

Got around to testing with Pi Zero 2 W. There is a couple of soundfonts I had issues with, namely "Arachno" but most soundfonts worked with no problem.

I found the overclock helped in some scenarios but you could also lower the polyphony to 200. IE run with 1.2GHz and 256 polyphony or 1Ghz with a 200 polyphony.

I let some midi tracks(7) run for a bit and recorded it. Seems to go fine.
https://youtu.be/TAFFamNjNmQ

Posted: **Wed Jun 29, 2022 9:28 pm**

Anim8 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 2:08 pm Got around to testing with Pi Zero 2 W. There is a couple of soundfonts I had issues with, namely "Arachno" but most soundfonts worked with no problem.

I found the overclock helped in some scenarios but you could also lower the polyphony to 200. IE run with 1.2GHz and 256 polyphony or 1Ghz with a 200 polyphony.

I let some midi tracks(7) run for a bit and recorded it. Seems to go fine.
https://youtu.be/TAFFamNjNmQ

Hmm, good to hear that most would work, though still wished it could be on par with a Pi4. I had no idea it was using that much of the PI4's power that the Zero 2 would still not be enough to match it.

As for the Midi Tracks, how complex are those though compared to the soundtracks in more musically involved games? I remember when I was looking into the Mt-32 and saw it mention that the DE-10 could do the MT-32 emulation on it's own ARM CPU, but that it was nowhere near powerful enough and games would stutter and lose sound, even though it could just play the MiDis themselves fine when it was not also running a game.

Do you have any examples of the games the Zero 2 was not able to handle? Wanted to know what it sounds like when it's not able to keep up.

Posted: **Thu Jun 30, 2022 7:16 am**

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 9:28 pm Hmm, good to hear that most would work, though still wished it could be on par with a Pi4. I had no idea it was using that much of the PI4's power that the Zero 2 would still not be enough to match it.

Pi4 stock is clocked higher, 1.5Ghz vs the 1Ghz of the Zero2. I don't have a Pi4 setup for MT32-Pi but I suspect its possible that in certain scenarios it wouldn't be fast enough either. Would have to test the same soundfont/config.

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 9:28 pm As for the Midi Tracks, how complex are those though compared to the soundtracks in more musically involved games?

Depends on the track but many of the midi's I used are more complex than what's normally found in dos games.
Here is the midi tracks I used in order: (edit: added some original(source ver) track links)

1. You Ain't the Boss of Me - Sigil by James Jimmy Paddock (2019) bandcamp original ver
2. Desk Lamp - by Stuart Rynn stewboy (2016) bandcamp original ver
3. Argent Energy / Harbinger - Doom 2016 by Mick Gordon, sequenced by D4V (2019)
4. Resonance - by HOME, sequenced by Astolfo Alter (2014) soundcloud original ver
5. One Night in Neo Kobe City - from Snatcher (1995)
6. Dreams - from The Incredible Machine 2 (1994)
7. Ocean Flute - by Stuart Rynn (2015)

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 9:28 pm I remember when I was looking into the Mt-32 and saw it mention that the DE-10 could do the MT-32 emulation on it's own ARM CPU, but that it was nowhere near powerful enough and games would stutter and lose sound, even though it could just play the MiDis themselves fine when it was not also running a game.

I found MUNT to have no issue with performance, mostly just when using certain demanding soundfonts(Arachno) with fluidsynth.

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 9:28 pm Do you have any examples of the games the Zero 2 was not able to handle? Wanted to know what it sounds like when it's not able to keep up.

Here is the Arachno SoundFont - Version 1.0.sf2 using the same midi track set as SGM-v2.01 from before.
Sound Warning: Audio contains uncomfortable popping / cracking noises at times, in particular track #2.
https://youtu.be/G4p7lbRZlFU

Its not so much any one midi alone but also the soundfont you use in conjunction with the midi that can be the issue.

For example, I can use Arachno v1.0 and the Zero 2 will trip up on select midi tracks but will be fine on the simpler tracks. Arachno is one of the more demanding soundfonts you can use, so that plus a demanding midi track can be problematic. When using the SGM-V2.01 soundfont + demanding midi tracks I've had no problem from what I've heard. So I've settled on using SGM-v2.01 currently, for the most part.

Posted: **Thu Jun 30, 2022 8:38 am**

Thank You for that example. Wow, track 2 of Arachno was really painful to listen to with how heavily it would crackle. Track 3 was pretty bad too.

Is this from a Zero2 just running on stock? Or is this while also attempting some of the mitigations you mentioned like reducing the Polyphony to 200 or overclocking it to 1.2GHz?

Posted: **Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:11 am**

Cyber Akuma wrote: ↑Thu Jun 30, 2022 8:38 am Is this from a Zero2 just running on stock? Or is this while also attempting some of the mitigations you mentioned like reducing the Polyphony to 200 or overclocking it to 1.2GHz?

Was Pi Zero2 at 1.2Ghz, Polyphony=256.

Have tested at 200 and 140 polyphony at 1.2Ghz. Was still not good with Arachno, most sound fonts worked just fine. Its just one or two that had issues, with Arachno been the worst offender.

Posted: **Thu Mar 16, 2023 9:13 am**

The Pi Zero 2W has been out of stock here in DK for ages, and there doesn't seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel. Are there other compatible devices that will work with the MT32-Pi? Maybe the Radxa RS102?

Posted: **Sat Mar 18, 2023 6:16 pm**

nrx wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 9:13 am
The Pi Zero 2W has been out of stock here in DK for ages, and there doesn't seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel. Are there other compatible devices that will work with the MT32-Pi? Maybe the Radxa RS102?

UK sellers are stating June for 2W if that helps.

Posted: **Wed Sep 27, 2023 6:27 pm**

I have a Pi Zero 2 W and have been looking at using it for a MT32 Lite, are there US based sellers who have a kit available?

Posted: **Sat Nov 11, 2023 12:13 am**

Is the MT32-Pi compatible with the Orange Pi Zero 2 W? Or might it become in the future?
http://www.orangepi.org/html/hardWare/c ... ro-2W.html

Posted: **Sat Nov 11, 2023 1:07 am**

Doubt it to both - it's (very) closely tied to the RPi kernel, as all bare-metal projects are

Posted: **Sat Nov 11, 2023 3:09 pm**

For those of us who own a real SC-55/88, is there some kind of way to connect them to the mt32-pi and get the sound from either MUNT on the Pi or the real Sound Canvas or does it kinda defeat the purpose and completely overcomplicate the setup ?

Pretty fan of my real SCs...

As for the GUS, oh yes, that's a must for the demoscene, high quality mixing in recent games etc.

MiSTer FPGA Forum

MT32-Pi and the Pi Zero 2 W

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