MiSTer FPGA Forum

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:55 pm**

Hello there!

So here's the stupid question of the week, I've been running my Mister (Antonio's version it has like 7 ubs ports) on 2.5amp/5V usb power charger and it's working great. However I couldn't help but asking myselft what would happen if I was to plug a 12v power charger.

I can tell you exactly what happened with my OSSC when I did this by mistake... and it was ugly even though I managed to frankenstein it back to life.

But for the Mister with all the usb ports and the noctua fan, I couldn't help but wonder if it would work out. I can't afford to take a shot blindly though. So anyone one's been using a 12V charger or is it as dumb as it sounds?

To be clear I have absolutely 0 knowledge in this stuff, so don't be judgemental, I've seen people on a French forum saying they were using 12v power on there Mister and it was seemingly running ok. So I was confuse why it's not mentioned in any English forum if it's a viable option. If it's an option what would be the advantages? Would it affect OC capabilities ? Would the fan spin faster?

Anyway looking forward hearing your opinion/ experience about this.

Thanks!

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:13 pm**

It's as dumb as it sounds. You'd be feeding it 2.5x the voltage it expects which would immediately fry it and quite possibly, anything connected to it.

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:21 pm**

Definitely a bad idea. More amps at the same voltage (5V) is safe because for whatever reason, the electronics only take what they need in amps even if the power supply can do a lot more amps. At some point, I suppose if the resistors weren't big enough, there could be too many amps as well. Not really sure how that side of the equation works.

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:24 pm**

You know microchips are filled with magical black and white smoke, right? To keep them functional, it is imperative that this smoke remains sealed inside the enclosure. Pushing too much power through the circuitry is a very effective method of releasing the trapped smoke, which would be.. bad.

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 5:44 pm**

I completely fried a usb hub and at least one usb connected device by accidentally using the wrong voltage power adapter with my Mister. Don't do it.

I'm not sure what those French people running 12V are actually doing, but typically if you have lots of things connected that draw power (wifi, fan, wireless keyboard etc) you want more AMPS not more voltage.

Everything on the de-10/mister is designed for 5v power input; stick to that.

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:19 pm**

Its AMPS you should be increasing, NOT volts.
If you want something better then look for a Meanwell 5v PSU. Something like the GST60A05-P1J 5VDC 6A. That is 6amps and that should be plenty.

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:33 pm**

Thanks for your replies guys, my OSSC absolutely agrees with you and I'm now extra careful with it... I never want my Mister to go through what my OSSC had to go through. I'm not even sure you have a safe fuse on the Mister like on the OSSC? At least I hope this thread will help people that could be tempted to do this... and not do it

Regarding the French dudes I don't know. It's the only reference to a 12v on Mister https://www.neogeo-system.com/t8470-how-to-mister-fpga I guess the person who followed these recommendations for a DIY Mister got a pretty bad surprised powering it on

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:35 pm**

MiSTer_Kirk wrote: ↑Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:19 pm Its AMPS you should be increasing, NOT volts.
If you want something better then look for a Meanwell 5v PSU. Something like the GST60A05-P1J 5VDC 6A. That is 6amps and that should be plenty.

Noted thanks!
There is no danger in going higher and higer with amp right? the Mister will just draw whatever it needs safely right?

Posted: **Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:10 pm**

Nope, no danger. I run that exact Meanwell PSU.
My Mister has all the usb ports used. I have a RGB Razor Keyboard, a AFX RGB Mouse, a Hori Arcade Stick, SNAC Adapter, 2 Displays - Philips CRT, Dell LCD, a external USB portable harddrive. All connected at once, and the Mister is running great with the Meanwell PSU.

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:25 am**

I used that Meanwell PSU as well, very good choice. Not to mention you can buy whatever length power cable (the part that goes into the wall outlet) you need. Not a big deal I suppose but why use a 6 foot cable when a 1 foot cable will do..in my case

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:35 am**

I wouldn't risk it. Many devices do carry over voltage protection in the shape of a voltage regulator, and some even contain diode brides which protects against reverse polarity but I don't know if the DE10 nano contains this protection. You could make your own as a little "extra layer of safety" project though

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:46 am**

de10-nano has overvoltage protection if powered through its DC-jack. Protection will cut the input voltage if it's over 6V if i remember right. Same protection i've used on Digital I/O board (if powered through its DC-jack).
If you power de10-nano through other ways, then 12V will definitely damage the board.

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:59 pm**

Sorgelig wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:46 am de10-nano has overvoltage protection if powered through its DC-jack. Protection will cut the input voltage if it's over 6V if i remember right. Same protection i've used on Digital I/O board (if powered through its DC-jack).
If you power de10-nano through other ways, then 12V will definitely damage the board.

But still not recommended to try it as an experiment

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 2:53 pm**

Sorgelig wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:46 am de10-nano has overvoltage protection if powered through its DC-jack. Protection will cut the input voltage if it's over 6V if i remember right. Same protection i've used on Digital I/O board (if powered through its DC-jack).
If you power de10-nano through other ways, then 12V will definitely damage the board.

I still wouldn't chance it myself. Just get a 5v power bank if trying use it portable don't use 12v car batteries.

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 3:24 pm**

Sorgelig wrote: ↑Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:46 am de10-nano has overvoltage protection if powered through its DC-jack. Protection will cut the input voltage if it's over 6V if i remember right. Same protection i've used on Digital I/O board (if powered through its DC-jack).
If you power de10-nano through other ways, then 12V will definitely damage the board.

Well thank you Sorgelig for your insights, I will definitely not try it though. I got curious on the topic after frying my OSSC using the wrong charger (It was 12V 1.5amp used for my 2nd router and was unplugged) I noticed my mistake after powering it on... The screen flashed and that was it. Thankfully the OSSC has a fuse, so nothing got damaged beyond the fuse.

Posted: **Tue Mar 16, 2021 4:51 pm**

There is also reverse voltage protection. (schematics sheet 22 : Q3 for inverse, Q2 for overvoltage).
Even if the board doesn't fry, it won't work either.

Posted: **Wed Mar 17, 2021 3:10 am**

Are there any components that could step down a 12V source into 5V, but still passthrough 12V? Would be very useful for modding arcade setups that need 12V for the screen (and maybe for the amp).

The only thing that I found that does this is the power part of an IDE hard drive adapter (suggested by Sorgelig long ago in another thread); but it's a bit wasteful to throw out the entire thing just to use the power supply. Plus I'm not sure if the amps it gives out are enough.

For bigger cabs, I could use a power strip with independent adapters; but it would be good to have a way to do this in a more space-saving way for modding countercades / pandora boxes etc.

Posted: **Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:03 am**

What your looking for is a buck converter or also known as step down converter.
Google/amazon/aliexpress that with 12v to 5v and you will find massive (and i mean MASSIVE) amount to choose from.

For example one of the more simpler ones.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00J3MHT1E/
Or
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01NALDSJ0/
But you can not change the output voltage on these and the last is 5,2v mister is probably ok with that but i´m not sure.

So my suggestion is too buy a buck converter you CAN adjust the output on they cost the same anyway.
Like one of these.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07PDGG84B/

Yes five pack but took the first one if found you can most likely find the same in one pack.

Or this one with display https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07WQJ2GD6/

i would go for adjustable ones since they are made extremely cheap the change of getting one non adjustable that output to high or to low voltage is way too big.
If you buy an adjustable one you can adjust it and as said price is the same.

You will of course need a way to see the voltage and sure there are buck converters that have displays that probably work ok, but again they are made extremely cheap and to me the risk of getting one that does not show the correct voltage is to big.
Therefore i would buy a decent multimeter to measure with, if i did not have one alreday.

i have an https://www.amazon.com/dp/B076GZK62B/
Multimeter that have gotten good reviews one many sites/youtube like eevblog that IF somethings are shit he says it pure shit! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdGQEVdxmQQ sure not perfect but really good for the price.

12v pass-trough is not needed at all just take the 12v from the same spot as the buck converter.

Posted: **Wed Mar 17, 2021 7:32 am**

Newsdee wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 3:10 am Are there any components that could step down a 12V source into 5V, but still passthrough 12V? Would be very useful for modding arcade setups that need 12V for the screen (and maybe for the amp).

The only thing that I found that does this is the power part of an IDE hard drive adapter (suggested by Sorgelig long ago in another thread); but it's a bit wasteful to throw out the entire thing just to use the power supply. Plus I'm not sure if the amps it gives out are enough.

For bigger cabs, I could use a power strip with independent adapters; but it would be good to have a way to do this in a more space-saving way for modding countercades / pandora boxes etc.

Depending on the Watts per channel you need, again one of the Meanwell's with dual voltage output may fit your need.

Meanwell RID-125-1205 (12V/9.2A + 5V/3A)

Meanwell RD-35A (12V/1A + 5V/4A)

Maybe there some further models like these.

Posted: **Mon May 31, 2021 1:26 pm**

Hi guys, I tried this experiment by accident. It didn't end well. the ao3412(part of the over-voltage protection) and LTC3612EUDC for the 2.5v rail are both fried.

I ordered some replacements and will have lots of fun soldering them, I have been practicing desoldering and replacing the cp2012 on some usb to serial boards. it has the same .5mm pitch and qfn package. They still work ok so there hope for my de10-nano.

I'll follow up in a few weeks if people are interested. as the parts are on backorder.

Posted: **Tue Jun 15, 2021 7:13 pm**

Just an update to my last post replacing the chip and transistor fixed the de10nano it's not an easy job but i think you know if your skills are upto it.

Posted: **Sun Jul 11, 2021 7:01 am**

@damopinn
Do you have a description where the chips are installed on the board?
Thanks for your help

Posted: **Fri Oct 29, 2021 12:43 am**

grizzly wrote: ↑Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:03 am What your looking for is a buck converter or also known as step down converter.

Looks like I never replied, but the buck converters are perfect for my build!
I found one that outputs 5V on a USB socket, so it works great for a MiSTer setup.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01NALDSJ0

Posted: **Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:47 am**

Imper wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 7:01 am @damopinn
Do you have a description where the chips are installed on the board?
Thanks for your help

Sorry its so late I missed your post. You can search for de10 nano schematic, you will find a very nice one and use it to identify the chips if you blew one, the test points make it super easy to check the voltages if this is your problem.

Posted: **Sun Oct 23, 2022 12:11 pm**

"Someone" (let's not dish out blame here) plugged a 12V power supply into the Mister and it wasn't until we realised that the USB keyboard and USB wifi adapter didnt work that I figured something was wrong.

When I saw how it was powered I yanked the cable out. The good/bad old smell of burnt electronics filled the room

Now I put the correct power supply in and the mister boots up and the top buttons work, the ethernet port works, and the analog I/O board VGA output and fan works. Thats about as much I'm able to test without any working USB ports.

Obviously the USB hub board does not work, and after disassembling the Mister, it seems that it's only the USB Hub board that smells burnt while the other two smell nothing.

I've already ordered a new hub board, but is there any likelyhood that the two other boar are damaged as well? It was plugged into 12V for probably a minute before I clocked the problem.

Posted: **Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:28 am**

de10-nano has overvoltage protection so it should be ok, if it didn't get blown out. The usb hub gets 5v directly from power connector and bypasses the protection, so the hub gets blown out and anything connected to it, I labelled the connectors after this happened so I would never make this mistake again, it's pretty scary.

Posted: **Wed Oct 26, 2022 5:08 pm**

Yeah, I did see a dark mark right on the usb connection on the hub. I've also found that the PS4 controller and wifi dongle that were connected are dead

But these things can be replaced, the de-10 seemingly can't (in the near future anyway)!

Posted: **Wed Oct 26, 2022 5:31 pm**

yeah, I've done it, it blows the usb controller chip and any dongle connected to it. DE-10 should be okay

Posted: **Wed Oct 26, 2022 7:29 pm**

Had the same experience with my OSSC a couple of years back which is also 5v. I used my tp link cable instead of the OSSC one... Managed to salvage it somehow by soldering one wire after the safety fuse and the other one to ground. I used a usb cable for that and the good thing about it now, is that it work with a battey bank and on the go. The bad thing is that I haven't used my OSSC in a while because of the Mister XD

Posted: **Fri Apr 05, 2024 10:50 am**

I used the 12v Adaptor from the de1-soc by mistake for the nano and it worked, also the de1-soc works with the 5v 6a adaptor i use for the mister.

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