The online community for MiSTer FPGA enthusiasts
https://misterfpga.org/
, I mean one day, the DE10 is still a great product with lots of room. Your claims are so bizarre, unwarranted, and most of all, unfair, that the only thing which springs to my mind is "trolling".Origin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:47 pm Coming here and begging people not to destroy the board is kind of weird. Either they build a somewhat robust end user device or they build some fragile thing only meant for professionals. But giving a fragile device into end users hands and then complaining about support issues sounds like they don't understand the basics of their business.
You can easily verify yourself if your DE10 Nano carries a CE certification mark and/or the WEEE logo. It's not cheap nor easy to meet the underlying requirements especially for a small business with a low volume device. This and the fact that the DE10 Nano is subsidized to be cheaper than its own FPGA alone has some consequences. Read e.g. here:
The replay cannot compete with the subsidized and CE-less DE10 Nano. Nor can the original MIST.You get a lot of FPGA for your money there, and Mister has been very successful. While Replay2 is the system that I want to own, it is going to be more expensive.
They are not begging for anything, they are giving some advices on how to handle the board regarding the SDRAM. I don't know in which world you live, in my world reaching out to a 3rd party forum to spread support information about your product is not begging, but reaching out to grant support.Origin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:47 pm ver, the solution is simple: Terasic could just build and sell a complete and cased MISTer compatible device.
It's their choice. But either way, they have to live with the result. Coming here and begging people not to destroy the board is kind of weird. Either they build a somewhat robust end user device or they build some fragile thing only meant for professionals. But giving a fragile device into end users hands and then complaining about support issues sounds like they don't understand the basics of their business.
The target market aren't just random beginners. They sell these to educators who are teaching people who have already taken a series of electronics classes most likely, and they sell them primarily to students who are already in electrical engineering courses or some other digital logic associated courses.
Origin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:47 pmAs a result it's simply not worth for anyone else to build a compatible end user device and they actually pretty much killed the original MIST board that way. This didn't happen by accident but someone decided to lower the price that way. What else did they expect to happen?
Nope, this is way under-powered as a device for professionals, it's for tinkerers, hobbyists, and above-all, students and classrooms.
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... d1e32-53-1 - Look under section 3 under Annex II. There might be some technical workaround or exception they are squeaking by into here. This mostly seems like consumer devices to me. But what do I know, maybe Mouser and other EU-based distributors have just been completely violating WEEE regulations for half a decade now. I doubt it, but it's possible, sure.
There is zero reason they would want to do this. It would end up being costly to them to do this, designing and selling it. Then since the big company is deciding to target the end user, like you said, they would probably have to get extra regulatory standards to be met. Validation processes to meet or exceed customers' expectations, up front costs, development time, etc... All so they can appeal to like the 1% of people that buy a DE10-nano for MiSTer, and just so they can maybe capture a small percentage of that market. It's unrealistic.
It's not weird. It's being proactive with their customers.
If you static shock your MiST or plug in the wrong power supply, the same thing will happen, so this is a moot point to talk about robustness of the end user device. And finally, their target end user are not MiSTer users, but they aren't exactly doing a laborious vetting of every single sale of their product, that would be inefficient.
Manuferhi sells the Mistica and the Sidi, both are excellent entry level machines when it comes to FPGA. Both are currently out of stock, but from my experience Manuel builds them in batches that are sold every few months. Just drop him a line, when they will be available again.FoxbatStargazer wrote: ↑Tue Aug 31, 2021 2:11 pm I have a hard time finding where there is stock of the cheap MiST clones these days. Maybe its because I'm looking at English pages though but these don't seem too accessible, which is a shame given the low price.
MiST itself seems to be a bit above the current price of a DE-10 nano, but at least it is complete and not requiring any addons.
That's some weird and flawed logic you've got there. Not only is the De10 not a gaming device, it isn't even really intended to be for the average end user, it is a subsidised teaching device aimed squarely at Universities. The fact people are buying sometimes full MiSTer systems without a single clue what is really going on, or even worse buying third party add-ons from unscrupulous eBay sellers is not remotely Terasics fault, and I say that as somebody who doesn't have much interest in jumping to company 'x' defence normally.Origin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:47 pm I don't really see the point. Terasic/Altera decided to bring the board into beginners hands to grow their audience. Thus they massively subsidized the FPGA on that board. As a result it's simply not worth for anyone else to build a compatible end user device and they actually pretty much killed the original MIST board that way. This didn't happen by accident but someone decided to lower the price that way. What else did they expect to happen?
So now they face the result: They brought a development system to be used by "professionals" into the end users hands and are surprised that people do all kinds of things with it. Actually this device was never meant for end users. It doesn't even come with the necessary CE and WEEE markings and selling this to European end users is just illegal.
However, the solution is simple: Terasic could just build and sell a complete and cased MISTer compatible device.
It's their choice. But either way, they have to live with the result. Coming here and begging people not to destroy the board is kind of weird. Either they build a somewhat robust end user device or they build some fragile thing only meant for professionals. But giving a fragile device into end users hands and then complaining about support issues sounds like they don't understand the basics of their business.
Origin wrote: ↑Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:47 pm I don't really see the point. Terasic/Altera decided to bring the board into beginners hands to grow their audience. Thus they massively subsidized the FPGA on that board. As a result it's simply not worth for anyone else to build a compatible end user device and they actually pretty much killed the original MIST board that way. This didn't happen by accident but someone decided to lower the price that way. What else did they expect to happen?
So now they face the result: They brought a development system to be used by "professionals" into the end users hands and are surprised that people do all kinds of things with it. Actually this device was never meant for end users. It doesn't even come with the necessary CE and WEEE markings and selling this to European end users is just illegal.
However, the solution is simple: Terasic could just build and sell a complete and cased MISTer compatible device.
It's their choice. But either way, they have to live with the result. Coming here and begging people not to destroy the board is kind of weird. Either they build a somewhat robust end user device or they build some fragile thing only meant for professionals. But giving a fragile device into end users hands and then complaining about support issues sounds like they don't understand the basics of their business.
I agree, my thought isHappehLemons wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:39 am You should revaluate how you communicate on here, because if there's any good point in here it's overshadowed by your awful attitude.
MiST and Till are awesome. This thread perfectly illustrates how MiSTer users probably make up 90% of unqualified idiots among de10-nano users despite only accounting for a few percent of overall users.annette wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:43 amI agree, my thought isHappehLemons wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:39 am You should revaluate how you communicate on here, because if there's any good point in here it's overshadowed by your awful attitude.
Origin = MasterOfGizmo = Till Harbaum (creator of Mist)
I agree and i still am a happy Mist owner.ToothbrushThreepwood wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 11:17 amMiST and Till are awesome. This thread perfectly illustrates how MiSTer users probably make up 90% of unqualified idiots among de10-nano users despite only accounting for a few percent of overall users.annette wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:43 amI agree, my thought isHappehLemons wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:39 am You should revaluate how you communicate on here, because if there's any good point in here it's overshadowed by your awful attitude.
Origin = MasterOfGizmo = Till Harbaum (creator of Mist)
And I count myself among those 90%.
Just let it die.
Hi, I am a new bee and I only have a DE10-standard. Is it OK to use DE10-standard instead of DE10-nano? thanks.
lake_lagunita wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2024 1:02 amHi, I am a new bee and I only have a DE10-standard. Is it OK to use DE10-standard instead of DE10-nano? thanks.
That is quite a necro-bump 
Cores have to be ported specifically for the DE10 Standard. There's a whole (old) topic about it here: https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=33067
Later on in that topic there are some links to cores that have been ported.
It does not have an HDMI connector, though VGA to HDMI adapters should work.