ENCC/SNAC8 Questions

[FoxbatStargazer]

So Lu's Retro Source recently put out a nice video on the Mister Plus kit by Antonia Villena. The kit includes an alternative I/O board, which features a DB9 port using a protocol I had never heard of: Extended Native Controller (ENCC) / SNAC8. I'm trying to understand what this even is, but only stumbled on this page, which has some basics, but I'm hoping some people who have some experience can answer some additional questions...

1) Is there any ENCC support in the Official distribution? There's a DB9 forked distribution of Mister (which update_all also covers) but it wasn't clear whether only some cores needed unofficial replacements or all of them. Certainly sounds like main does need to be replaced if you want to use ENCC to control the HUD menu.

2) ENCC seems focused on Genesis and Neo Geo controllers, so what happens to other cores? If I plug a real Genesis 6-button into the db-9 port, can I use that to play the SNES core, or must I get a converter for a real SNES pad? If I can use a Genesis controller on the SNES, is this bypassing Linux and any polling or input lag? What about custom mapping the buttons?

3) Again ENCC is focused on Genesis for the DB9 controllers, but what about Atari-style DB9 joysticks? Can those interface to the Microcomputer cores like C64, Atari ST, Amiga?

4) Is this port still capable of all the same things as regular SNAC with say the right adapter? Could I connect a NES zapper somehow and use that with the NES core?

Thanks for any light anyone can shed on the situation...

[C-R-T]

I’ve also tried to find out what this is but it seems to be some kind of secret club for some reason.

[grizzly]

SShhh!
Don´t tell them!

As far as i know and i could be wrong.
1, No!
2, It has the same drawbacks as regular SNAC SNES gamepad will only work on SNES core, and genesis will only work on genesis core.
3, Only if there are a DB9 core for C-64/etc.
4, Yes as long as you have the correct NES to DB9 adapter board/cable and DB9 NES core the zapper will work, and so on with the snes bazooka/etc.

The things that is changed compared to regular SNAC is DB9 instead of a USB3 port a different core is needed and that you can use two controllers (with the right cores off course) instead of only one.
SNAC8/DB9 also can controll the mister GUI.

[FoxbatStargazer]

When a core has ENCC support, you'll see a new option in the OSD menu called "UserIO Joystick" that allows playing with joysticks of Mega Drive/Genesis (DB9) or Neo-Geo/Supergun (DB15)...

So is this just kind of unfortunate phrasing here, and the real takeway is supporting DB9 and DB15 ports on custom I/O boards, rather than adding Genesis or Supergun support per se to all these cores?

[lu_source]

Hi, that's my video so I will be able to answer some questions because I was also faced with the same questions you have. While I do not have any inside knowledge, Antonio Villena has answered some of my questions, but I'm mostly doing a lot of testing. I'm working on a full video regarding regular SNAC and ENCC.

1) I don't think the official distribution has support for ENCC because if I do not enable the ENCC option in "update_all", my original Genesis controller does not work with the OSD. When I enable ENCC in "update_all" then it does work. Some cores (100+) already have support for ENCC (I dont know which ones) while others will need the forked cores.

2) Yes you can use a Genesis or Neo Geo controller to play other cores, control the main OSD and a core's OSD. No converter is needed, just plug in the genesis controller directly to the DB9 port and you can use it on any core. However this is not in SNAC mode but a new "User IO" mode.

Other original non-DB9/DB15 controllers still wont work with the OSD, but maybe an adapter such as this(https://www.raphnet-tech.com/products/s ... /index.php) will probably work.

You can NOT custom map your buttons on the OSD or a core, but cores have presets you can use.
On SNES the presets are (Config 2 makes more sense to me):
Config 1:
Genesis Button -> SNES Button
A -> Y
B -> B
C -> A
X -> L
Y -> X
Z -> R
Start -> Start
Mode -> Select

Config 2:
Genesis Button -> SNES Button
A -> B
B -> A
C -> R
X -> Y
Y -> X
Z -> L
Start -> Start
Mode -> Select

I would assume for the DB9 to work on the OSD, Linux is not being bypassed. In the cores there are separate options for DB9 and SNAC, and when I use it in SNAC mode, I can't access the OSD with the controller.

3) I dont know if Atari, C64 or Amiga controllers will work. I don't have any of those controllers but I can try to find out.

4) Yes, it also works as regular SNAC. So you can still use an NES light gun. I've already tested a Zapper light gun and it works great. It also enhances SNAC to enable two original controllers in a core for 2 player gaming. You will need a two player adapter for the console or you can get the Decapod by Antonio that will give you 2 player ports for all the major 8 and 16 bit systems.

A custom IO board is also required for ENCC to work. I hope this helps.

So Lu's Retro Source recently put out a nice video on the Mister Plus kit by Antonia Villena. The kit includes an alternative I/O board, which features a DB9 port using a protocol I had never heard of: Extended Native Controller (ENCC) / SNAC8. I'm trying to understand what this even is, but only stumbled on this page, which has some basics, but I'm hoping some people who have some experience can answer some additional questions...

1) Is there any ENCC support in the Official distribution? There's a DB9 forked distribution of Mister (which update_all also covers) but it wasn't clear whether only some cores needed unofficial replacements or all of them. Certainly sounds like main does need to be replaced if you want to use ENCC to control the HUD menu.

2) ENCC seems focused on Genesis and Neo Geo controllers, so what happens to other cores? If I plug a real Genesis 6-button into the db-9 port, can I use that to play the SNES core, or must I get a converter for a real SNES pad? If I can use a Genesis controller on the SNES, is this bypassing Linux and any polling or input lag? What about custom mapping the buttons?

3) Again ENCC is focused on Genesis for the DB9 controllers, but what about Atari-style DB9 joysticks? Can those interface to the Microcomputer cores like C64, Atari ST, Amiga?

4) Is this port still capable of all the same things as regular SNAC with say the right adapter? Could I connect a NES zapper somehow and use that with the NES core?

Thanks for any light anyone can shed on the situation...

[FoxbatStargazer]

Awesome, thanks for this info! So it seems the "DB9/15 joystick" is a different thing from SNAC altogether, and you can use a 6-button genesis (or maybe a supergun arcade stick?) to control many cores including Super Nintendo. I'm kind of curious whether this mode is subject to similar polling lag to USB, but its probably not easy to test a 1ms difference...

The main modern DB9 Atari joysticks I am using is the ArcadeR, it says it can be jumpered for compatibility with Genesis so maybe that can work with ENCC and microcomputer cores.

Anyway great job with this video and I really look forward to one on ENCC in the future!

[antoniovillena]

So Lu's Retro Source recently put out a nice video on the Mister Plus kit by Antonia Villena. The kit includes an alternative I/O board, which features a DB9 port using a protocol I had never heard of: Extended Native Controller (ENCC) / SNAC8. I'm trying to understand what this even is, but only stumbled on this page, which has some basics, but I'm hoping some people who have some experience can answer some additional questions...

SNAC8 is an extension of SNAC6 (io board <=6.0) and SNAC7 (io board 6.1). It's backwards compatible. The fork is maintained by a Spanish group formed by Neuro999, theypsilon and Oskarz.

1) Is there any ENCC support in the Official distribution? There's a DB9 forked distribution of Mister (which update_all also covers) but it wasn't clear whether only some cores needed unofficial replacements or all of them. Certainly sounds like main does need to be replaced if you want to use ENCC to control the HUD menu.

You need to replace all cores you want to manage with native controls. Some official cores work with the DB9 hardware like NES/SNES/Genesis but only player 1 and without OSD manage.

2) ENCC seems focused on Genesis and Neo Geo controllers, so what happens to other cores? If I plug a real Genesis 6-button into the db-9 port, can I use that to play the SNES core, or must I get a converter for a real SNES pad? If I can use a Genesis controller on the SNES, is this bypassing Linux and any polling or input lag? What about custom mapping the buttons?

With Genesis and NeoGeo controllers you can play all cores on the fork (more than 100 cores). The NES/SNES/PCE controllers are partially supported: That's only manage their own cores by SNAC option. We want to full support in the future. Yes, you bypass Linux so input lag is minimal. You can't custom map the buttons, because you are bypassing Linux and custom remapping through the core is very complex.

3) Again ENCC is focused on Genesis for the DB9 controllers, but what about Atari-style DB9 joysticks? Can those interface to the Microcomputer cores like C64, Atari ST, Amiga?

All Atari-style DB9 are compatible too. Of course with a limit of 2 fire buttons. As replied above with that joystick you can play all cores supported on the fork (more than 100), included C64, Atari ST, Amiga.

4) Is this port still capable of all the same things as regular SNAC with say the right adapter? Could I connect a NES zapper somehow and use that with the NES core?

Yes. All the SNAC stuff, like NES zapper, is supported. It's backwards compatible. All things you can do with SNAC6/7 you will do with SNAC8

[tms9918]

What is the switch on the db9 to two db9 for?

[antoniovillena]

What is the switch on the db9 to two db9 for?

That switch toggles function between pin 5 and pin 7 for the two DB9 connectors. That's for support genesis controllers (near de edge position) and joysticks with autofire (near the center position).